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Tag: phil johnson


The Fallout

A commenter named Dan McGhee at Denny Burk’s blog, coming from The Convergence, made a good insight, which I have noticed myself among pastors my age in their commentary on this whole ordeal (read below). I’m in the minority on the position I’ve taken with others my age in case you’re wondering, at least it seems to be the case. As Phil Johnson pointed out in a series of predictions he made, from a previous post, Elephant Room 2, with the invitation of T.D. Jakes was the first real test of the validity, strength and sustainability of the Young, Restless, Reformed movement in the face of doctrinal error. It appears to me it has failed primarily by succumbing to the lure of postmodernism in discourse. This is very unfortunate and I pray it can be changed. Unfortunately, if we learn anything from church history, it’s that seemingly innocuous decisions, even when done with well-meaning intentions (as I believe they were), have very serious consequences and implications [bold, italicized font mine]:

Denny, the damage that ER2 has done in the overall body of Christ is going to be felt in the years to come. Already I am hearing of conversations with younger, impressionable, college-aged men, who are headed for ministry and currently in Bible college studying for ministry, who are now wondering “What’s the big deal? TD Jakes affirmed the trinity.”

For the life of me I can’t understand how otherwise solid men can’t see how this is going to lead to Jakes’ prosperity-theology being main-streamed into the evangelical church in the years to come. Not to mention, the idea that oneness theology and trinitarian theology “aren’t really that far apart because it’s only a matter of semantics” is now firmly planted into the soil of evangelicalism. Make no mistake, this thinking will sprout, grow, and spread in the days to come.

All of this is the result of men being ENAMORED with mega-church pastor successes (numerically), which of course, is now being defined as “fruitfulness.” Obedience to 2 John 7-10 could have spared the church of Jesus Christ must damage that will no doubt result, and already is.

Mark Driscoll, The Elephant Room, and Why I Left Acts 29…

Some of the Best Posts on the Elephant Room Debacle So Far

What Was the Point of the Elephant Room Forum? – Phil Johnson and Todd Friel

Phil Johnson was right on in his predictions, that much is for sure. On the other side though, Phil also addresses hyper-seperationism and those taking upon themselves discernment ministry unwisely to a unproductive and in many cases destructive degree. In this, many have a proper critique of us who critique, and Phil actually expounds upon this matter better than some who criticize us for criticizing. Anyway, point duly noted.

The Legacy of Charles Finney

I still have yet to understand why so many leading evangelical pastors (Billy Graham and the late Jerry Falwell to name two) and others in the movement uphold this man as someone who championed the faith once for all delivered to the saints. If there is one person that can be blamed for so many of the current theological and ecclesiological problems we find in the evangelical movement (though there are many causes to be sure), it is Charles Finney. These articles deal with the content of what Finney taught and how it was anything but evangelical, in the historical, Gospel sense of the word.

After reading these, you will see a little bit clearer how much of his influence is still felt in the church today and how much damage it continues to cause. Even much of the pragmatic, mega, seeker movement in the church owes its pragmatic thought process about how to “get people in the door” to the teaching of Finney, which he himself rooted in the error of Pelgius, the fifth century heretic. Very insightful.

Postmodernism and The Emerging Church – Phil Johnson (MP3’s)

You Can’t Handle The Truth: Addressing the Tolerance of Postmodernism (MP3) – 3.3.2005

A Beginner’s Guide to Postmodernism (MP3) – 6.30.2006

What is the Emerging Church Movement, and why is it a problem? (MP3) – 7.1.2006

The Theory of Relativity (Understanding the influence of post-modern thought on the church today) (MP3) – 3.7.2007

Politics and the Gospel – Part 2

After the election, in my own thinking, I have been working through how we as believers are to approach the preaching of the Gospel and politics. Particularly from the Reformed camp, I keep seeing two answers to this (broadly speaking, knowing there are probably more).

One answer is that we can do both Gospel-preaching and be politically active on issues such as abortion or feeding the homeless or whatever your pet issue may be, so long as the political activism does not eclipse the Gospel message. One example of this would be someone like William Wilberforce (mp3 audio biography) who fought to abolish slavery through legislation and eventually won in British Parliament (something I am extremely grateful for).

But the other camp says we should not be politically vocal at all really for the sake of the Gospel, stating that all we need in culture is pure Gospel-preaching and living and the culture will change as the Lord uses that preaching and living as He sees fit to save people and move in the core of their being on these issues. At this point, I’m leaning toward this second response, though I sway back and forth.

During the election, I leaned toward the first answer, that we can do both Gospel preaching and at the same time be publicly involved in the political process on various issues, attempting to convince others, as best we can, of the rightness of it. However, in hind sight, and after having read a blog post by Phil Johnson, as well as this one, I’m second guessing my original stance now. I just have to think to myself, “Did others, especially unbelievers, remember what my political stance was or how great Christ is?” I feel like maybe to my shame it is the former answer.

Now of course, I know that the Gospel should take priority above politics; that is a given. But I’m still navigating through this issue and swaying back and forth on what I should do next time around or even before then. I’ll confess to everyone that sometimes, I got a little bit too excited about the whole thing. I saw through the political nonsense at times, and at other points, I got caught up in the nonsense. At times it distracted me from my pursuit of Christ in prayer, the Word and studying of theology. For this, I was clearly in error.

So how involved should we be in politics as believers, if at all? I pose this question to get ideas from others. I think about Tim Keller (along with Phil Johnson’s comments) and see the amazing fruit of not going after political issues. Through pure Gospel-preaching and living, he has transformed an area of Manhattan that would not otherwise have been possible (i.e., I highly doubt anyone in Manhattan would listen to a rant about abortion, knowing of course at the same time that it is indeed morally wrong, abhorrent and murderous, that regardless, a lot of walls would go up instantly with these hearers).

But then I think about John Piper as one of my heroes of the faith and his vocal stance from the pulpit in clearly proclaiming the evils of abortion. I also think about John the Baptist in telling Herod he was in the wrong and as a result having his head cut off. Standing up for morality can be costly, but the question is, why are you doing it? So I’m really wrestling through this issue at the moment. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

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